Fri, 29 Feb 2008 18:00:04 -0500
...even more so since it appears to be driving Obamatrons insane!
It's a twofer.
;)
"The Right always knows who its enemy is" Lance Mannion
What a great ad. It pulls at the heartstrings. I don't see it as fear based at all.
Wes Clark Democrats...let the Clinton campaign know who sent you
Well, I think 3am is just a random in the middle of the night time. (Although if you ever saw the Exorcism of Emily Rose, it's the demonic witching hour bwahahahahaha ;)) The narrator has to get his message in... and Hillary's in the last frame in the "ta-da" moment, so the phone rings 6 times.
Wes Clark Democrats...let the Clinton campaign know who sent you
I'm mean she's dressed elegantly with not a circle under her eye. Are we to believe she sleeps in those clothes?
:-)
I don't care what she's wearing. To have Hillary in the White House again along with the great team (that would probably include WES) gives me a lot of comfort.
:)
Our friend's mother died last month. She was very ill for a couple of weeks before she died. Whem our friend told us that she was "taking a turn for the worse." We told our friend to call us anytime..."even 3:00 in the morning."
The reason imho why it is the perfect time to put in the ad is because it represents both too late and too early for people to be awake. Some people stay up to 2:00/2:30AM because they watch the late shows. Some other people wake up 4:00/5:00AM to get up for their job. It's normally a "deep-sleep time."
The normal amount of staff wouldn't be with Hillary at 3:00AM. I know that there is always a team keeping an eye on everything. Yes, many could quickly be contacted and be part of a decision, but there could be decisions that need to be made immediately. When someone wakes up at 3:00AM for emergency situation, they better be a person that has spent much time to be prepared as possible for such an event. They better be quick thinking... look at things from all angles -just like how a great QB could make a defense seem "slower" - when the great QBs are focused, calm, and know where all their teammates should be. They know all the angles. If the 1st option is taken away they could immediately go to so many other options.
I could picture Hillary with her "game-face on" to handle the difficult tasks. She'll use imagery to picture exactly where everyone of her team would be and their responsibilities. She would know all the options and all the angles for those options. She would be thinking so fast and in control that the emergency would seem to "slow-down." She'll expect the expected and the unexpected. I believe she'll engage the appropiate action/actions that is best suited to accomplish the serious task at hand. When the time is crucial and an immediate decision has to be made - I want Hillary to make the call (of course I would like Wes more than anybody, but give me Hillary way over Obama and McCain).
This is my take on the ad. It's perfect.
The Ann Richards ad is as well. The Clintons should respect the dead, as well as have the intergrity not to engage in fear-mongering.
I thought Clark was against fear-mongering. What has happened?
don't you think that Democrats should also be strong on National Security? I don't see it as Karl Rove inspired at all. I remember those Bush ads. Constant reminders of 9-11, images, etc. This ad had none of that.
Wes Clark Democrats...let the Clinton campaign know who sent you
and 9/11 and Iraq aside...what about China? Pakistan? Russia? Iran? There's a whole world out there to deal with. And they don't love us.
Please see my blog:
http://securingamerica.com/ccn/node/14881
I see your point about fear-mongering and to some extent, I share your concern. I think we need to have a rational discussion about that here--no finger pointing, no aggression, no defensiveness. Let's just talk about it.
Write a blog about it as if you were talking to Wes. You respect him, right? Post a blog here about it and talk to him. It won't help if you just post negative things about Hillary. You have to present it as if you were having a discussion with Wes, where you had to demonstrate to him while he was arguing back with you, why you think she's fear-mongering and why you think that goes against what he's has been saying to us for 4 years. This is Wes's site and if you don't sound as if you're giving him the benefit of the doubt, nobody's going to listen to you. And that would be a real shame because your opinion is important.
We learn. We change. That's progress. If we don't do that, well, we're GWB.
You're right. I will consider posting such a blog.
I believe Clark supported Clinton because he knows the Clintons well, felt she was qualified, and wanted to help unify the party early. I understand and respect that. Reasonable people can disagree, and Obama is in the process of proving himself still.
concern trolling back to Obama's web site. You're no different than the ads you deign to complain about.
On Obamabots: I suspect he could have sex with a kitten in the Senate rotunda and they would blame it on the cat.
On Obamabots: I suspect he could have sex with a kitten in the Senate rotunda and they would blame it on the cat.
There is a reason that ad hominum attacks are discounted in professional debate. We have tried it that way for 8 years. Do we have more liberty or less liberty than when we started?
We must change the rules by which the game is played.
with the express purpose of playing havoc with the good people who inhabit this cyber-space, don't expect me to be kind or to bend over backward to kiss their collective asses. Those days are over. The rules have changed. If I were in charge, they would be gone in an instant. We don't go to Obama sites and try to fu*k them up, instead we get these childish posters screwing around, making snide and nasty comments in order to get there jollies off. What it does is solidify our opposition to Obama. With "supporters" like ConcernedCitizen, who need enemies? I know Obama can't control his supporters, but he sets the tone, and doesn't seem to anxious to calm it down. Screw them all, as far as I'm concerned.
On Obamabots: I suspect he could have sex with a kitten in the Senate rotunda and they would blame it on the cat.
then this is also not Obama's site as well.
Or we have the right to talk about both in diplomatic way...
Instead of coming here to promote someone he does not want anywhere near the WH.
On Obamabots: I suspect he could have sex with a kitten in the Senate rotunda and they would blame it on the cat.
....which is your right.
But to bring it to his own blog?
I'm sorry, I find that reprehensible.
"The Right always knows who its enemy is" Lance Mannion
Although I don't think it's a requirement that to blog here you have to support Hillary Clinton. I don't come here for the sole purpose of attacking Hillary, I have always found that I like the people here and have found that they have always been kind to me and respectful of what I have to say.
Not anymore. Now I feel like if my opinions don't line up 100% with what the majority says I get asked to go away.
Sad.
who come here to troll, like ConcernedCitizen, doesn't bother you, than you are not the kid I thought you were.
On Obamabots: I suspect he could have sex with a kitten in the Senate rotunda and they would blame it on the cat.
Jordans11: Hang in here.
Clark Supporters in Exile, a substantial group, plan to return to the CCN no later than The Ides of March.
Very similar to just before NH.
Smelling blood in the air.
"Hope"fully the end result will be NH redux.
"The Right always knows who its enemy is" Lance Mannion
...have just as strong positive feelings for General Clark as you and others.
My sense is that they feel they were driven off their homestead, and my understanding is that they will return to the CCN by the Ides of March, irrespective of what happens this coming Tuesday.
That's a curious date to choose, Gordon. Can you explain why you and other Obama supporters plot your return for that date? That has a sinister feel to it but I can't quite get the Clark/CCN/hopeful Obama victory/Ides of March connection.
I know that Wes believes in the freedom of speech, but its odd that several who support Obama think that everything will return to what it was if he wins. If Hillary loses this opportunity, so does Gen. Clark lose. He's wholeheartedly supported her, traveled and spoken for her, because he feels she is the best person for the job. That means he doesn't feel Obama is the best persn for the job. He has encouraged us to work for her, campaign for her, contribute to her because he wants her to win.
Are you saying you plan your return to be the turd in Clark's punchbowl? That's what it sounds like.
is negative? Sadly, it's true. Wes had all the candidates to chose from but he chose Hillary to endorse. I suspect the only reason he would support O, who doesn't know a rifle from an aircraft carrier, is because he's a democrat. I can't prove that, but you can't prove the stuff you're saying, as well. So there. :)
On Obamabots: I suspect he could have sex with a kitten in the Senate rotunda and they would blame it on the cat.
that some Obama's supporters, and I am not saying all are like this, come in here and just want to get some Clark supporters annoyed… I don’t want to point fingers at no one and I don’t want this post to start on who started first etc. Please I hope not.
From what I know, you seem to be diplomatic…
And from what I have seen, there are good Clarkies (Hillary supporters) whose intentions are meant for good, not to cause stir but to defend what they believe.
Now the question is, what do we do when someone doesn’t want to give up and will use any means to just "win" the conversation rather then bring solutions on the table even thought one has to humble a bit ?
...busting his hump travelling all across Texas trying to get Hillary nominated.....and stop Obama.
I'm astounded that you think it's ok to push your own candidate on his site.
Just astounded.
"The Right always knows who its enemy is" Lance Mannion
because he believes in Hillary, not because he wants to bring Obama down.
I'm astounded that you find it more productive to slam Obama supporters and urge them to leave instead of trying to calmly convince them to see your point of view. What would Wes say if he were here do you think?
Would he say..
"All you Obama supporters, get out of here. Your behavior is reprehensible. All of you who admire me so much, get out."
Or, do you think he would say something more like this...
"This country was founded on the principles of the Enlightenment. It was the idea that people could talk, have reasonable dialogue and discuss the issues. It wasn't founded on the idea that someone would get struck by a divine inspiration and know everything, right from wrong. People who founded this country had religion, they had strong beliefs, but they believed in reason, and dialogue, and civil discourse. We can't lose that in this country. We've got to get it back."
Because that last one is an actual quote.
...support whom you like but please don't work against me on my own board....
No one is saying don't come here, just have the good grace to refrain from posting stuff that is blatantly counterproductive to what Wes is trying to do.
Wes ran in 2004 in part to stop a candidate who was way ahead in the polls and had no foreign policy experience tho' Dean at least had executive exp. Obama has zero 'anything' experience. My guess is that Wes is pretty worried right now. He has spent 34 years in a meritocracy, where "experience does matter".
If the worst comes to pass, it will go against everything he believes in to back someone who is fundamentally unqualified for the job. Oh, he'll do it because he's a Dem and will always back the Dem.....but there is no question in my mind that he will be uncomfortable with it and maybe plain unhappy. But like a good soldier, he'll suck it up and march on. Sometimes I wish he had not joined the party at all and had remained Independent. I wonder if sometimes he feels the same way.
"The Right always knows who its enemy is" Lance Mannion
at saying it goes against everything Wes believes to back Obama if he ends up being the nominee. We've never heard Wes Clark speak badly of any of the other Democratic nominees - He feels Hillary Clinton is best, but that doesn't mean he feels the others are not qualified.
Speaking personally, it is difficult to stay independent these last few years - the Evil Republican party makes it impossible.
"It takes two to speak the truth - one to speak and one to hear." - Henry David Thoreau
Please see my blog: Please see my blog:
http://securingamerica.com/ccn/node/14881
I may be voting for Hillary Clinton, but I'm voting for choice B in your question. :)
We learn. We change. That's progress. If we don't do that, well, we're GWB.
Who is saying anything about Wes wanting to bring O! down?
What's with making up these airy arguments then answering them yourself? It's like a closed loop: "They said it couldn't be done..." << the sort of strawman argument that O! tends to make & which drives me crazy.
The issue of an inexperienced CIC with a lack of familiarity with navigating the federal system & compounded by no firsthand personal experience with military matters would, I believe, give any former NATO commander pause.
That said, I'm sure there's a lot WKC can find about O! that shines. I mean, he even managed to say that John Edwards was a quick study, you know. He's a generous man. It just didn't outshine what he sees in Clinton.
What amazes me is how the Dems have internalized the contempt of the Clintons foisted on us by the msm to the point where the blogs are littered with Stockholm Syndrome & have no compunction kicking the Clintons like dogs when they represent the only actual success the dems have had for decades.
Really bizarre.
"to stop Obama"
I don't think that is why he's out campainging.
"People who founded this country...had strong beliefs, but they believed in reason, and dialogue, and civil discourse. We can't lose that in this country. We've got to get it back." - Wes Clark
That isn't what was said. You are injecting what you wish to read & bristle at into what was said.
"Wes ran in 2004 in part to stop a candidate who was way ahead in the polls and had no foreign policy experience tho' Dean at least had executive exp. Obama has zero 'anything' experience."
"Wes Clark is ....as we speak.....
Submitted by mad4clark on February 29, 2008 - 9:22pm.
...busting his hump travelling all across Texas trying to get Hillary nominated.....and stop Obama."
I disagree with that stop Obama part. I think he's campaigning because he believes in Hillary, not because he wants to somehow "stop Obama".
He didn't endorse Hillary to "stop Obama" in my opinion. You can be for someone without wanting to take down the other person I think.
"People who founded this country...had strong beliefs, but they believed in reason, and dialogue, and civil discourse. We can't lose that in this country. We've got to get it back." - Wes Clark
We didn't just agree. You didn't cite "stop" then say you don't believe it.
If Wes endorses HRC whether it is to "stop" Obama, or simply because is his expert judgement she will make a superior CIC, is it not six of one and half a dozen of the other? If you're in a horse race, does "Reality Check" run merely to stop "Messiah Sunshine" or does she run to win? Where's the there there?
I believe by Donjo that Wes "doesn't want Obama anywhere near the white house."
That's the kind of thing that I just don't think I agree with. If Wes spent his whole day going around and denouncing Obama then maybe I'd think again about him, but I think he's more "for Hillary" than "against Obama". That's my point. Of course if you are running against someone I guess by default you are trying to "stop" them but it comes down to the question of why does WES support Hillary? Is it because he thinks she is the best or because he wants to stop Obama. Anyway...
"People who founded this country...had strong beliefs, but they believed in reason, and dialogue, and civil discourse. We can't lose that in this country. We've got to get it back." - Wes Clark
don't seem to believe that WKC endorsed HRC simply to "stop" Obama- a comment or two flying by on a thread is not going to change that overriding sentiment & fact, sorry. I definitely don't feel obligated to go over any thread with a microscope to argue semantics with someone at the cost of a larger point. And speaking of "points" I'm not only tired of tilting at windmills, of the gamesmanship, but am also bone weary of the parsing obsession too many O! supporters seem to share with their candidate.
I was responding to that one comment. I wasn't saying that most people think that's why he endorsed Obama. I read one comment I disagreed with. I said I disagreed with it and said why. I wasn't making any statement about what everybody thinks.
"People who founded this country...had strong beliefs, but they believed in reason, and dialogue, and civil discourse. We can't lose that in this country. We've got to get it back." - Wes Clark
the campaign of the man you profess to support has its heavy hands involved in radio, flyer, and telephone campaigns to "STOP HILLARY NOW. Put and end to the Clintons once and for all. Become a democrat for a day." This has been verified in SC, TX, FL, and probably most other states of you look hard enough.
This is the campaign of the "honorable" candidate you chose to run with. You profess to admire Wes Clark and his philosphy; what do you think he thinks about this sort of "campaign," which has NOT been denounced or rejected by Obama. More importantly, what do you think of it?
I have only seen Obama flyers that criticize Hillary on NAFTA and on Healthcare.
If you can find any radio, flyer, and telephone campaigns sancitioned by the Obama campaign that say "STOP HILLARY NOW, put an end to the Clintons once and for all!" I'd be happy to look at it and give you my reaction. I'm just not sure they exist but I'd love to see them if they do.
"People who founded this country...had strong beliefs, but they believed in reason, and dialogue, and civil discourse. We can't lose that in this country. We've got to get it back." - Wes Clark
you would have seen the photo of the flyer from S.C. that was posted here some days ago; you would have read the posts from people in TX that repeat exactly what I have written and read the e-mails sent out to repubs; you would have read the DU post from S.C. that commented on the hate Hillary being spilled on black radio down there. You would have read the letter to the editor in our state newspaper from a republican who said he was voting democratic in order to vote for Obama in order to Stop Hillary. (There's been several letters of that same nature that I've read.) All of this to Stop Hillary. What I expect you to do, is to give me a example of Obama telling his troops to STOP doing this in his name. He hasn't and won't, because he's determined to foist himself on a hapless public. Ethics be damned. With your help, I might ad.
"...We cannot lead by example unless we are sustained by good leadership. Nothing is more important." Wes Clark
the time to read this:
http://securingamerica.com/ccn/node/14884#comment-286857
"...We cannot lead by example unless we are sustained by good leadership. Nothing is more important." Wes Clark
E.G. - just take a gander at YouTube and Daily Kos.
The major advantage to un-official attacks is that they are plausibly deniable.
If you can find any similar number of un-official attacks on O by Hillary supporters, please point us to them.
O's repetitive official attacks on Hillary (e.g. the repeated distribution of the flyers you mention) have been bad enough. But the fact that so many of his supporters post extremely negative attacks on Hillary online also says quite a lot about their sense of ethics. It looks like great numbers of them are quite willing to believe that the end justifies the means.
Nick Kelly
Wes Clark still could be the national security candidate.
...someone who wanted to donate to Hillary and have CLark get the credit. /snark
hmmmmm
Sure you are a Clark supporter.........NOT
"The Right always knows who its enemy is" Lance Mannion
I have been blogging here for more then a year almost everyday and I was never disrespected by any Clarkies, even thought I brought up some delicate issues.
All of you are in my prayers, always, regardless if I agree or disagree with what goes on in this community, and I am happy I got to know people like Clarkies.
From what I see, everyone is gifted in here and can make a good diff. for this country in so many ways.
Is that anything like an arch support in your shoes?
Oh boy, though! I look forward to the "legions" coming around. If they're anything like the "gaggle" we have now-- it's gonna be a blast around here!
Here's to Hope and Unity!!
I got troll rated for Hope and Unity! :) Yikes!
In all the years I've blogged here, I think I have given out two to three 0's -- and that was when our former blogger kept dragging Wes into the mud. As we wrote in the user guide... they are to be dispensed very rarely and for "Malicious or troll posts" only.
That's where definition comes in handy.
But to pass out 0's like so much candy is truly a curious expression of ... the spirit of unity.
Ah but I shall survive even the donuts hurled in my direction! More sprinkles please!
I will stand up, dust myself off, and forge ahead to face yet another day steeped in the forces of unity!! :P
of a "midnight skulker."
"...We cannot lead by example unless we are sustained by good leadership. Nothing is more important." Wes Clark
Your Karma rating is approaching "0". An astonishing thing for one who only signed up recently. If it drops to "0" your posting privileges may be suspended.
Not a ban, but rather a 'time out'.
Your 'star rating' (Karma) can be viewed by accessing your profile. Everyone begins with a standard rating of "2". Community members add to or subtract from your Karma rating by voting on a scale of 1 to 4 on any or all of your posts and comments.
Consider this a cautionary note.
a "zero."
On Obamabots: I suspect he could have sex with a kitten in the Senate rotunda and they would blame it on the cat.
...of the first star, donjo.
I know it doesn't show up in IE....but just click the space directly to the left of the first star. You'll know it worked by looking at the karma count.
We need to get this .....concerned troll gone. Probably a republican but certainly NOT a supporter of Wes.
"The Right always knows who its enemy is" Lance Mannion
The 3:00AM ad is a dose of reality. Democrats need to face reality before it's too late. Hillary is much more prepared to react to an emergency (as well as everyday events).
Also, the ad with Ann Richards in it is very respectful and loved-filled. It remembers Ann fondly. She would have loved the ad. Also, I felt that it allowed Ann to still be part of the political movement for her dear friend. The strength and energy of Ann Richards LIVES ON! I'm still smiling because of it!
made me feel very happy. Peaceful, sweet looks on their faces.(Wish I could sleep that well) I didn't get a feeling there was any fear mongering at all. I didn't feel fear when I saw it. I also, saw a very competent woman answer the phone. I felt security. Just like when BC was in office. Just sayin.
Now, when I see Rove's adds I do feel a terrible fright.
MsG
"I don't think Texans scare that easily..."
IF you're scared of a phone ringing and worried about the decision-making ability of the person who picks it up, maybe you should rethink your support of Obama. Does the idea of a phone ringing with a crisis to handle scare you?
I don't know anyone who got scared because they saw the ad. Several though that admitted it gave them second thoughts about who should answer it .... and not in Obama's favor.
The phone ringing in the middle of the night will happen. It's just a matter of when..... and about what.
I know this has been answered before, but I would like to contribute to HRC through Wes. Can someone supply a link?
https://contribute.hillaryclinton.com/wesclark.html?rc=GDY5
"The Right always knows who its enemy is" Lance Mannion
The HRC campaign is trying to get 30,000 donations in 48 hours.
Last I saw they were at 13,000.
I think this may be the last big push for HRC so if there is ever a time to help out, this is it.
The NJ campaign headquarters called me to make phone calls on Monday, so I''m going to do that too. I want to feel like I did everything I could for my candidate.
woman -- who just had a harrowing two days wherein most of my 08 business income was wiped out just like that .... it felt good to donate my meager amount I could to Hillary today. It was like she would understand what it's like to struggle against all odds and have no choice but to push forward. And with a temperature and the flu! :/
I hope she gets 60,000 donations. Nothing is too small guys.
My suggestion is to e-mail that message to Hillary and to the anchors of the political shows on TV. It shows how you personally are impacted by the critical level of the economy right now, and also how much you believe in Hillary Clinton.
We're proud of you ms in la. A big hug goes out to you. (((MS IN LA))). Get well soon. Hopefully, your business will make a good rebound.
Who troll rates a question about how to donate to Hillary on Wes' site? That is seriously effed-up.
Wes Clark Democrats...let the Clinton campaign know who sent you
who signed up 2 days ago. Someone needs to call Kat.
On Obamabots: I suspect he could have sex with a kitten in the Senate rotunda and they would blame it on the cat.
NBC Nightly News just showed a clip of Wes introducing Hillary in Waco, TX today with a number of other retired military....in conjunction with new ad on TV dealding with who do you want answering the national security phone at 3am.