Wed, 14 May 2008 18:00:04 -0400

Submitted by AmericanPatriot on May 14, 2008 - 5:37pm.

If we work hard to elect the next President of the United States.

“Senator Clinton and I share a worldview in which diplomacy is the best first-strike tool in our arsenal; in today's complicated global system, the United States should be making more friends than enemies."

http://hotlineblog.nationaljournal.com/archives/2007/09/gen_wesley_clar.html

The alternative to this worldview is blind to the realities of the world in which we live. Blind enough to think 100 years of Americans in Iraq is a workable foreign policy for America. John McCain is as dangerous as he is naive.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VFknKVjuyNk

Submitted by CentralMass on May 14, 2008 - 5:46pm.

The prerequisite to that is that you need an electable candidate.

Submitted by donjo on May 14, 2008 - 5:51pm.

if you have the faintest idea of how to do it. It also helps if you've actually done ANYTHING on your own before. Reading a speech prepared by someone else won't hack it.

We're electing the President of the United States, not some g.d. prom king.

hf jai's picture
Submitted by hf jai on May 14, 2008 - 7:58pm.

You were going away.

You're as reliable and trustworthy as the candidate you support.


Submitted by AmericanPatriot on May 14, 2008 - 8:13pm.

If Hillary Clinton is the nominee I will support her enthusiastically. She's run a great campaign so far and done her supporters proud.

hf jai's picture
Submitted by hf jai on May 14, 2008 - 8:45pm.

No reason to stand by your word?

Now why doesn't that surprise me....


Submitted by AmericanPatriot on May 14, 2008 - 11:26pm.

The reason for I decided that was to not stir any further animosity among fellow Clark supporters. That's not a problem now.

I stand with Hillary Clinton.

Submitted by Kathy B. on May 14, 2008 - 11:29pm.

In-gray-she-ate.

Submitted by Tega on May 15, 2008 - 2:00am.

He doesn't deserve the Presidency and the Country doesn't deserve him.

hf jai's picture
Submitted by hf jai on May 15, 2008 - 10:25am.

I'm talking about what you told us you were going to do.

An honorable man lives by his word. Changing your support doesn't change that fact.


Submitted by Kathy B. on May 14, 2008 - 5:38pm.

And if there's one thing I learned during my thirty-four years in the Army, it's that real leadership comes from acting and doing. Not talking and debating. It comes from setting real goals, and being held accountable for achieving them. It's about putting the nation's interests above any personal or political interests. And I simply couldn't stand by and watch the country I fought for unravel before my eyes, while the people in Washington did nothing to stop it. I had to stand up for the ideas and the values I believed in.

Wesley Clark's Speech 1/28/04 -True Values Tour, Tulsa, Oklahoma

jen's picture
Submitted by jen on May 14, 2008 - 6:04pm.

By Jeralyn

He begins with long praise for Hillary and goes into a unity pronouncement. He was good.

Now he's getting to the endorsement.

He starts with issues, which is odd, since the Obama and Hillary are so similar on them.

Update: He's not mentioning one distinction between Hillary and Obama. He's just reciting Democratic values. If you didn't know he was going to endorse Obama, you would have no idea he wasn't going to end by endorsing Hillary.

Now he says the voters have made their choice and there is one man who knows how to create change and it is Obama. So that's the reason for endorsing Obama.

So this is about ending the race, not about who would be a better President or who can better beat McCain. [More...]

The rest of his endorsement is not about Obama but a repeat of his own campaign speeches about One America and poverty.

I heard no reason to support Obama over Hillary other than ending the race and unifying the party, which he calls "One America."

It's over. It could just as easily have been Hillary standing next to him receiving the endorsement. Did anyone hear an explanation of why Obama would be a better candidate to win against John McCain?


Once in a while you get shown the light, In the strangest of places if you look at it right.


jen's picture
Submitted by jen on May 14, 2008 - 6:27pm.

given JE an offer he couldn't refuse. But more than anything, I think this is about the Dem elite trying to end the race and shove O! down our collective throats.

My advise to those in the Dem leadership who haven't bought the hype being marketed and sold to the American public -- stay as far away as you can. Oh, I know if O! is the nom, our General will support him and ask us to, but I hope he does what he minimally has to and keeps his focus on Congressional races. I don't want O!'s implosion anywhere near Clark! I also hope O! makes it clear to Hillary and Bill he doesn't want or need their help. It would sicken me to have to see them out stumping for this charlatan, as if they believe what he's selling.

I imagine Mr. One America will be out stumping in the small rural towns that have no use for O! But I don't see that any of O!'s endorsements thus far have done very much for him, and I don't expect this one to, either. It just gives Corporate Press another reason to sweep Hillary's whomping of O! in WV yesterday under the rug. I would bet that this endorsement was saved back just for such a time as this. Establishment Dems have already decided who the nominee is and yesterday's stomping had to be neutralized.

I'm thoroughly disgusted and done. I have been wavering on if I can vote for O! if he's the nom. Now I know I can't.


Once in a while you get shown the light, In the strangest of places if you look at it right.


Submitted by ARforWKC on May 14, 2008 - 6:34pm.

I just heard on ABC news that the announcement was scheduled so that it would change the subject from his big loss in WV yesterday.

Submitted by ms in la on May 14, 2008 - 6:44pm.

How To Dominate A News Cycle When You Don't Like What's Being Reported

Create a new news cycle!

It's become utterly transparent already -- and we're only months into this. Oh I think I'm feeling seasick! :/

Submitted by James Mitchem on May 14, 2008 - 8:18pm.

Is nothing compared to Rove. With all due respect if the Honorable Senator from New York cannot overcome Axelrod, she will have a real uphill battle against Rove. Axelrod can create a news cycle, Rove created reality for 4 years. Axelrod just not in the same ballpark, he isn't even in the same league as Rove.

All this proves is Obama is the better chess player. He knew he was going to lose WV, very badly, I knew that, he knew it, everyone knew it. So instead of hurling stones argrily at the ocean and trying to win or do well in WV and humilating himself and his campaign by throwing everything he had at an unwinnable battle he accepted reality as it was and moved on. It was electoral triage.

Having moved on Obama took the next logical step: damage control. He changed the terms of engagement he moved to steal Clinton's thunder. It is also worth mentioning that Edwards 18 delegates erases Clinton's 12 from WV, giving Obama a positive of 6 delegates in the last 48 hours.

Do any of you think even for one moment it was a coincidence that NARAL and Edwards endorsed Obama on the same day, let alone this day after his biggest defeat in any contest since Super Tuesday of all days? This was planned, perhaps from before he won NC and came close in Indiana.

Obama saw West Virginia coming from a mile off, we've all seen the exit polls, and the demographics of WV aren't exactly top secret. It's not much of a leap of the imagination to assume he would lose badly. That is why he didn't campaign there, he knew it was going to be a massacare.

He prepared for the inevitable outcome of WV, mitigated the damage by taking what should have been Senator Clinton's big day and rolling out two big endorsements. What was Obama supposed to do, let the pundits speculate about his performance among what the honorable junior Senator from New York calls: "Hardworking white Americans" for a week and let Clinton bask in the glow of victory? That's just not really a great electoral strategy.

Obama made a bold play, outflanked Clinton and scored. Now he can focus on driving down Clinton's margins in Kentucky, racking up popular vote in Oregon and sowing the seeds for landslide victories in Montana and South Dakota. Also Michelle Obama is hard at work in Puerto Rico where polls show a tightening race.

I'm an Obama supporter, as such I think it would be fair to say we accepted West VA as it was. However, Obama has rolled out the big guns on Kentucky, Gov. Tim Kaine of the Commonwealth of Virginia sent a letter yesterday calling for Obama supporters to go to Kentucky. Furthermore I'd be willing to bet Edwards is going to be on a plane to Kentucky. In West Virginia, we were barely even asked to make phone calls.

Obama is going fight tooth and nail for every vote can get in Kentucky and he will fight with everything he's got. We may not win, in fact we probably won't but we are going to give it everything we've got and make Clinton work and pay for every single vote. Furthermore, he will fight to win every vote he can in Oregon where polls show him up by 20%.

Sen. Clinton isn't up against a fool, she is up against one of the best politicans of the past 3 decades, a master chess player who knows when to roll the dice and when to fold. Who knows when to hold back the reserves for the engagement. Clinton has had her day. As for tomorrow; well let's just say tomorrow is another day and leave it at that.

Submitted by briarhopper on May 14, 2008 - 8:26pm.

can win in the GE, he should have an easy time of it. Maybe he could spend all the free time he'll have windsurfing with Kerry.

mad4clark's picture
Submitted by mad4clark on May 14, 2008 - 8:28pm.

Really?

He outspent her in WV two to one.

And yes....I remember how much Edwards helped Kerry.

As for fighting tooth and nail.....that's something he DOES NOT do....because it's hard work....which is why he bought Edwards instead of doing the hard work of actually campaigning.

Hopefully the voters will see through the ploy.

"A nation that is afraid to let its people judge the truth and falsehood of ideas in an open market is a nation that is afraid of its people." JFK


Submitted by James Mitchem on May 14, 2008 - 11:05pm.

Yeah, that's the advantage to have 1.5 million small donors.

What we threw at Clinton in West Virginia was nothing but a token. We have money to burn, the Clinton's on the other hand are by some estimates up to $20 million in the hole. We can outspend her two to one and we don't even feel it, that is the reality of the situation.

Sen. Obama has assembled the most powerful fundraising operation not only in this campaign, or in democratic party politics, but in American politics period. If we had taken west VA seriously we would have outspent her by at least 4 to 1.

With regards to Edwards, I wouldn't call it a ploy, more like a wise tactical deployment of a valuable strategic resource.

I don't know what Edwards sees in Obama or Obama sees in him. However, I doubt he was "bought" as some here have alleged, at least not in terms of money. More likely Edwards sees Obama as a more effective and dare I say realistic vehicle to push through some of the policies Edwards wanted.

Obama has a lot of reasons for wanting Edwards, Edwards's base is exactly the kind of voters Hillary has depended on, that is who his message appeals to. Edwards will make a very effective spokesperson for Obama. Obama speaks in grand sweeping terms, "hope" and "change" his message really doesn't reach these people. The concepts are too abstract for the voter who makes up their mind without digging through mountains of information online for many years on end, or watching hours of cable TV. It just doesn't connect with those people. Edwards on the other hand is more like Bill Clinton, minus the baggage.

Edwards can walk into small town and rural areas of Kentucky and he can do for Obama what Bill has done for Hillary. He knows how to speak in terms people in these areas will appreciate, instead of dealing in grand sweeping terms such as "change" and "hope" Edwards can define to these voters what exactly that means for them. In terms of jobs, access to affordable quality education and health care, in terms of rebuilding, modernizing and improving infastructure. Edwards stands the best chance of just about any Obama endorsee thus far to reach these people and bridge the communication gap.

Edwards was a coveted endorsement, by both sides, ther will no doubt be spin from both sides on the importance of this. But the main thing to keep in mind is that Edwards is a very usful asset among the voters Hillary has come to depend on, if she loses them, or even if her margins slip it is over, because that is all Clinton has, she doesn't have the broad coalition Obama has to fall back upon. If there is no Edwards effect at all Obama will still do just fine. But if there is an Edwards effect, there is nothing else left for Clinton to fall back upon. Right now I am estimating an Edwards effect of about 10% to 15% max Obama might rack up another 5% by touring heavily, and he might get another 5% if he really pours the money in, which I think he will.

Edwards was one of the big three and Obama won him over and used his support to maximum effect. It is pretty obvious where Pelosi is leaning, which leaves Al Gore outstanding. And Gore will remain above the fray to play peace maker probably.

Submitted by ms in la on May 15, 2008 - 1:27am.

Do you really believe that all it would have taken was more spending -- and Obama could have won West Virginia? If he had decided to "take it seriously" that is....?

How many millions do you think it would have taken to win over those people? And then is it the same thing in Pennsylvania and Ohio and California, etc? Just more spending, coupled with the decision that it might matter, was worth the effort-- and Barack could have had them all?

Not being snarky here... just curious if that's what you believe.

Submitted by James Mitchem on May 14, 2008 - 10:11pm.

What prompted that? A candid analysis of the events of the past 36 hours? In what way was my comment trollish? I think some kind of explaination is warrented, after all my comment was not a personal attack on anyone here, nor did I cross into the hyperbolic.

You people do realize shooting the messenger doesn't change the facts.

hf jai's picture
Submitted by hf jai on May 14, 2008 - 10:20pm.

You'll be able to tell the difference between spin and facts.

Until then, it is dishonest and disrespectful to use General Clark's website to campaign for Obama or campaign against Clinton.


Submitted by James Mitchem on May 15, 2008 - 12:31am.

Nope, you just clicked a mouse pointer because you didn't like what I have to say. Unfortunately, with all due respect sir, you may forget that once this nomination process is over your abusive troll rating will still have an effect on my Karma rating.

I have been a supporter of Gen. Clark since the draft Clark days, and yet I am about to lose my place here if these abuses of the troll rate continue. I have been given two choices, shut up, or get voted off.

And to be quite honest this is overkill, Hillary Clinton is far from the first Clark endorsee to get less than the total support of all clarkies. Jim Webb was targeted openly right here on this very blog, first in the primary by some members as anti semetic. And as being sexist in the GE.

Those members were not troll rated as I have been, so why exactly are alleged attacks on Hillary held to a different standard than the actual attacks on Webb?

It is the idealogical purists that are shrinking Gen. Clark's base of support who are doing Gen. Clark a diservice. Not me.

So kindly, feel free to criticize me, insult me even if it works for you, even post abusive comments about me like Jack does. But please, lay off the abusive troll rates.

Hillary Clinton was not the begining of Wes Clark, nor shall it be his end. I am very much looking forward to having a nominee so we can all be Clarkies, Democrats progressive independents again. The circular firing squad is getting quite tiresome.

hf jai's picture
Submitted by hf jai on May 15, 2008 - 10:37am.

So I told you. But you have already made up your mind that my REAL reason was something else, so why did you ask?

If you look at my history of 0 ratings, you will find that I have been pretty consistent in how they are applied. I downrate for promoting Obama, attacking Clinton, or attacking other CCNers. This is General Clark's website and you are abusing it (and us) when you work at cross purposes with him and his objectives.

I feel safe saying I have NEVER given anyone a 0 rating just because I disagree with them. And you can ask almost anyone who's been here a while: I disagree with people quite often, and usually quite vociferously as well.

But believe what you want. That seems to be the most common characteristic of Obama supporters anyway. Just don't expect the courtesy of a direct answer to your questions.


Dormaphaea's picture
Submitted by Dormaphaea on May 15, 2008 - 11:08am.

'circular firing squad?' A bunch of posters on an out of the way blog? How about you take a look at the circular firing squad that is the current leadership of the Dem party.

That's the one about which you might lend some concern. That's the one that's gonna bump John McCain right into the Oval Office come 2009.


jen's picture
Submitted by jen on May 14, 2008 - 10:21pm.

for the evangelical vote.

So how is Barack trying to appeal to Kentuckians?

As a religious candidate.

Some day maybe you will realize what a charlatan this guy is. Maybe not.


Once in a while you get shown the light, In the strangest of places if you look at it right.


mad4clark's picture
Submitted by mad4clark on May 14, 2008 - 10:37pm.

Huckabee voters?

What....does he have no faith in SOMW?

"A nation that is afraid to let its people judge the truth and falsehood of ideas in an open market is a nation that is afraid of its people." JFK


madspawn's picture
Submitted by madspawn on May 14, 2008 - 10:42pm.

He really epitomises the word "disingenuous".

Wes Clark Democrats...let the Clinton campaign know who sent you


Submitted by cubbiebear on May 15, 2008 - 12:15am.

n/t

Submitted by ms in la on May 15, 2008 - 12:28am.

bad ending.

Submitted by cubbiebear on May 15, 2008 - 12:39am.

Don't care for the ending

jen's picture
Submitted by jen on May 14, 2008 - 11:35pm.

by Scan

.
What happens when a "presumptive" nominee is utterly embarrassed by a 41-point spanking in a key swing state at the hands of a candidate that the media aggressively proclaimed as "dead"?
.
Well, panic seems like a start. They can be cool and confident on the outside all they like, but make no mistake: West Virginia stung and stung bad. You need only look around at the Obama blogs to get a sense of that. I'll understand if you can't bring yourself to go there, however, No Quarter has helpfully posted an incredible doozy for your enjoyment. Don't miss it.
.
In response to the thorough butt-kicking last night, David Axelrod brought together his former and current clients today for an endorsement... one specifically timed to trample on Hillary's interviews tonight and sweep coverage of her West Virginia blowout off the top of the nightly news. So be it. That may be the definition of "effective politics", but most people would call that being a jerk. Honestly, I don't think it speaks well of either of them and may hurt more than help.
.
I am most assuredly not alone in my thinking that Edwards' endorsement today reeks of bandwagon opportunism. Had he endorsed either candidate back in February, it might have meant something. Now, this just adds to the narrative that helped propel Hillary's astonishing win last night: One woman against the world.
.
So please, please, keep this pile-on coming. Do keep the backlash going strong by insisting over and over that the race is over and the voters shouldn't bother. Because a 40-point spread would be fantastic in Kentucky as well.
.
Lets face it: Obama has the money, the media, the establishment, and the pledged delegates. No getting around that.
.
What do we have? Well as of now, and by the end of this process, we've got a little metric known as the votes. We've also got something else that's even more important: A winning candidate and by far the strongest choice for President of the United States.
.
And if the Democratic establishment doesn't like it and continues to shove the weaker candidate down our throats...to hell with them. Still I stand by Hillary until the final vote is cast.
.
Oh and one more thing, Barry...



Once in a while you get shown the light, In the strangest of places if you look at it right.


Submitted by AmericanPatriot on May 15, 2008 - 12:03am.

but yours is way off, friend.

Submitted by James Mitchem on May 15, 2008 - 12:22am.

But then again, I'm not sure any time would have been the right time. I saw the same attitude by some people towards Jim Webb. I don't forget those things easily.

When this little nomination is over Gen. Clark will have lost a lot of good people to the idealogical purists. An awful lot, and I think that is a shame because at no point did General Clark make any statement than could be construed as advocating the removal of those vocally supportive of Obama.

Submitted by AmericanPatriot on May 15, 2008 - 12:51am.

Unfortunately, that's what happens in politics. We have to try and rise above it and follow General Clark's lead whenever we can, but more importantly his values.

He won't lose me to those "partisan purists," ever.

Arky Sue's picture
Submitted by Arky Sue on May 15, 2008 - 1:47am.

We know about the vitriol you posted about Wes Clark on Du...
I still have heard no repudiation of what you posted.
You are a BO troll, creep. It's not going to make a difference if you come here and make all nice. We have your number.


Submitted by AmericanPatriot on May 15, 2008 - 9:23am.

and will continue to post here as well as support WesPac and the candidates Clark is supporting for Congress.

What is it, exactly, you feel I should repudiate?

Dormaphaea's picture
Submitted by Dormaphaea on May 15, 2008 - 9:39am.

First word: a 360 degree shape.
Second word: rhymes with 'perk.'

I always wondered what one of those looked like.
Heh.


madspawn's picture
Submitted by madspawn on May 15, 2008 - 10:38am.

What did we get.... maybe a few hours of celebration after Hillary's victory in WV? I don't know why you are so surprised that people get annoyed with your comments here.

We get it, okay... Obama's just soooo great that we should all buck up and get behind him. Regarding his greatness, don't pee on my leg and tell me it's raining. I'm not buying it. And neither did most of the state of West Virginia.

Wes Clark Democrats...let the Clinton campaign know who sent you


Submitted by Tega on May 15, 2008 - 10:56am.

He's just the media's next "Messiah" who with the help of the media and his false "Racecard" accusations put him ahead of the race. Without biased reporting, O would have been called on using the Racecard. His candidacy should have been smothered - just like W should have been in 2000. W didn't give specifics and neither does O. Those in the media aren't doing their job.

So - it's not a matter of what candidate is outplaying the other, it is the media screwing a candidate and screwing the country.

Submitted by Barry_NJ on May 14, 2008 - 6:34pm.

I think that one of the many email alerts I got on this may have hit the nail on the head (I don't know which one I was too busy deleting!).

They said he sounded like he was trying to be the peace maker for the Dem party. He's trying to create a new image of himself as the one who brings the party together for the GE. To me that sounds like the kind of thing that Edwards would do.

If he bargained for a job in Washington that sounds out of character to me.  If he were appointed Attorney General for something he'd have to show up for work and try to accually accomplish something. That doesn't sound like Edward's style to me.

Barry
Are you safer today than you were seven years ago?©

LJM's picture
Submitted by LJM on May 14, 2008 - 6:52pm.

it's for the benefit of John Edwards. I wouldn't try to psychoanalyse anything he does beyond that point.


LSophia's picture
Submitted by LSophia on May 14, 2008 - 10:37pm.

I've always thought Edwards was a jerk. Nice to have my opinion confirmed.

Unity my left shoe. He wanted to bail Obama out, so if Obama gets the nomination, he'll be rewarded with a nice Cabinet position. Makes sense - except that he and Obama are several light-years away from each other on health care.

I must say, seeing the two of them together reminded of the way some of the guys used to gang up on the smart girls in class to try to get them to shut up. It's a sad memory. :(


Arky Sue's picture
Submitted by Arky Sue on May 14, 2008 - 11:09pm.

I recall in one debate where somw ridiculed BO for voting against a 30% cap on interest rates for credit cardss.
I read somewhere recently that one credit card (don't rmember which) has a penalty rate of 31.99% interest.
Nah, we don't need no stinkin' caps. Fool.


Submitted by Tega on May 15, 2008 - 2:13am.

JE is all about himself.

Submitted by ms in la on May 14, 2008 - 6:38pm.

to be shoving odd tasting things down our throats again.

After all, John Kerry was only shoved down our throat with a dangling John Edwards attached to it barely 3 1/2 yrs ago. I still have the nasty indigestion and sour aftertaste from that one...

It's like cramming a steaming batch of brussel sprouts down your baby's mouth after you just finished stuffing it with smelly boiled cabbage.

Enough already.

Give us time to digest this crap.

My mouth is clamping shut just as Howard Dean and Donna Brazile head towards me with that heaping shovel full of O! meal to shove in it.

Snap! I will not open up.

I am ready to dump some tea in a harbor somewhere.

Didn't the Founders give us some kind of advice for a time like this... an "in the event of..." primer?

A third party would be so fitting right now.

jen's picture
Submitted by jen on May 14, 2008 - 6:41pm.

would be killer! I don't understand how true blue Dems can still think this party is worth saving after seeing how they've run this campaign! ENOUGH!! Can you imagine it! OMG! Hillary, Bill, Joe Wilson, RFK, Jr. General Clark, and all the others who are not part of the insider big boyz club Dem elite cretins, breaking off and forming a new party!! Oh, what a dream!!


Once in a while you get shown the light, In the strangest of places if you look at it right.


PAforClark's picture
Submitted by PAforClark on May 14, 2008 - 6:51pm.

Clinton aren't part of the Dem elite.

3rd party puts John McCain in the White House. If you really want that - go for it.


"It takes two to speak the truth - one to speak and one to hear." - Henry David Thoreau


mad4clark's picture
Submitted by mad4clark on May 14, 2008 - 6:55pm.

...have NEVER been part of the Washington elite

They gave ALWAYS been treated like "hicks from AR."

Which is why the Elite are doing everything they can to stop Hillary right now.

"A nation that is afraid to let its people judge the truth and falsehood of ideas in an open market is a nation that is afraid of its people." JFK


Submitted by ARforWKC on May 14, 2008 - 6:58pm.

I would rather have the "Hicks from Arkansas": than the snobish elites from Chicago.

mad4clark's picture
Submitted by mad4clark on May 14, 2008 - 7:01pm.

"A nation that is afraid to let its people judge the truth and falsehood of ideas in an open market is a nation that is afraid of its people." JFK


Arky Sue's picture
Submitted by Arky Sue on May 14, 2008 - 7:11pm.

;)


Submitted by Marti on May 15, 2008 - 7:14am.

I don't want them anywhere NEAR the WH!!!!!!

PAforClark's picture
Submitted by PAforClark on May 14, 2008 - 7:00pm.

Who do you consider the elite Dems? I think of all the politicians who have been in office for more than 10 years as elite.


"It takes two to speak the truth - one to speak and one to hear." - Henry David Thoreau


mad4clark's picture
Submitted by mad4clark on May 14, 2008 - 7:08pm.

...the Blue Bloods......Kennedys, Kerrys, Deans, etc.

They did exactly the same thing to Carter

And it's not just the Dems.

What you have to understand is all politicians, Dem and Repub...go to the same parties in DC and hob nob with the same people.

Bill and Hillary did what they could to fit in, but nothing they did was good enough for the DC Insiders....see may articles and books

The DC Elite consist of "acceptable" members of both parties, the media, the Rich and the Powerful.

"A nation that is afraid to let its people judge the truth and falsehood of ideas in an open market is a nation that is afraid of its people." JFK


PAforClark's picture
Submitted by PAforClark on May 14, 2008 - 7:08pm.


"It takes two to speak the truth - one to speak and one to hear." - Henry David Thoreau


Submitted by Phyl on May 14, 2008 - 7:58pm.

Of this elite DC social group is the pundit
class of the so called "press." These people
never gave Bill Clinton credit for anything
and spent the last months of his Presidency
ignoring anything he did except Monica.
That's one reason Wes is not better known and
respected by the public and press. Part of
the failed Clinton Presidency, you know.

Submitted by James Mitchem on May 14, 2008 - 11:53pm.

Seeing as Carter has all but endorsed Obama. He certainly hasn't spoken very highly of the Honorable Junior Senator from New York, he had harsh words for Florida and Michigan and openly opposses the supers overturning the pledged/elected delegates, which would be a shoe in for Sen. Obama...

Submitted by Tega on May 15, 2008 - 2:15am.

Kennedy and Kerry.

madspawn's picture
Submitted by madspawn on May 14, 2008 - 7:02pm.

is a life long Republican. Has been involved in politics for most of his adult life and also held office as mayor. We've had many colorful political conversations in the past.

But for the past 4+ years or so, he's been telling me they (Republicans/Dems) are all the same. The idealist in me never wanted to hear that. You know what? I think he's on to something.

So yeah... if O! is the nominee, I'm seriously considering voting 3rd party.

Wes Clark Democrats...let the Clinton campaign know who sent you


jen's picture
Submitted by jen on May 14, 2008 - 7:13pm.

They never were and never have been accepted by the Dem elite.

I've said for a long time, if O! is the nominee, I will work and donate to Congressional races to build up the Dem majority. I'm in NV, and it will go McCain if it's him against O! with or without my vote.

Once in a while you get shown the light, In the strangest of places if you look at it right.


madspawn's picture
Submitted by madspawn on May 14, 2008 - 6:50pm.

mad4clark's picture
Submitted by mad4clark on May 14, 2008 - 6:53pm.

....if the Dems manage to screw the best candidate since BC.

Dead.

I may even vote for old man Crazy McCain. That's how far at the end of my rope I am.

All my life I wondered WHY do the working class vote Republican? This election has opened my eyes to the truth...

Both Parties screw the working class, but only the Republicans speak to them with respect.

We finally get a candidate who connects with the working class......and the Dems are doing everything they can to bury her so they can run another NE effete elite.

And no......SOMW will not help. You cannot put lipstick on a pig.

"A nation that is afraid to let its people judge the truth and falsehood of ideas in an open market is a nation that is afraid of its people." JFK


PAforClark's picture
Submitted by PAforClark on May 14, 2008 - 6:57pm.

geography this evening...Republicans speak to the working class - but the language is lies.

Did New York move to the Midwest...?


"It takes two to speak the truth - one to speak and one to hear." - Henry David Thoreau


Dormaphaea's picture
Submitted by Dormaphaea on May 14, 2008 - 7:32pm.

Lakefront (Elitist) Democrats, Hyde Park (Elitist) Democrats, Daley machine.

This is a world class (depending on your definition of class) city, and it's politics is one hand washing the other all over the place for power, greed, and um...power. To what end. I have no idea.

But I've been looking at it close up going on 30 years now, and I tell ya what, the last decent leadership we had in this city was Harold Washington. He actually eschewed the whole frigging system, and the elites hated him. It was terrific.

But you don't have to be on the east coast to have snobbery. We've got it here like you wouldn't believe. I invite you to Lincoln or Hyde Park anytime. The money class in Chicago controls everything here.

Edited to add: I've actually been voting for Republicans for local, county and state elections for quite some time.


Submitted by Barry_NJ on May 14, 2008 - 8:13pm.

Once upon a time I also lived out Chicago way but I have a much simpler view of things.

Any city that includes Wrigleyville and the Cubs is a world class city.  And there's no room for discussion on that!

However, when the city has a mayor who sends bulldozers out in the middle of the night to destroy a historic airfield clearly local politics is rotten to  the core.

Barry
Are you safer today than you were seven years ago?©

mad4clark's picture
Submitted by mad4clark on May 14, 2008 - 8:22pm.

and the rotten Machine.

"A nation that is afraid to let its people judge the truth and falsehood of ideas in an open market is a nation that is afraid of its people." JFK


Dormaphaea's picture
Submitted by Dormaphaea on May 14, 2008 - 8:38pm.

but the Cubbies leave me cold. Sorry! I just have to look at too many disappointed faces year after year after year.


hf jai's picture
Submitted by hf jai on May 14, 2008 - 9:06pm.

"I just have to look at too many disappointed faces year after year after year."

Maybe it should be tattooed on my butt instead.

 

:P


LSophia's picture
Submitted by LSophia on May 14, 2008 - 10:33pm.

if Hillary leaves the race, I leave the party. I will give money to individual candidates or races, but I will not call myself a Democrat any more. I'm done with a party that passes over an eminently qualified, well-connected COMPETENT candidate in favor of one with the shortest resume ever, no matter how good a speaker he is.


kaflinn's picture
Submitted by kaflinn on May 15, 2008 - 10:38pm.

:-) (very old story - and no, it isn't me, lol)

"Our public servants work for us - we don't work for them. We have an obligation, as citizens of this country, to always remember that - and to never let them forget it." - DeadMessengers


Submitted by Mary on May 15, 2008 - 12:27am.

This is the year! ;)

Submitted by cubbiebear on May 15, 2008 - 12:41am.

but there comes a time when we all have to face reality

Submitted by Marti on May 15, 2008 - 7:18am.

GOOOOO CUBBIES!!!!!!

Dormaphaea's picture
Submitted by Dormaphaea on May 15, 2008 - 7:36am.

This is how they do it...every year. Dear fellow Clarkie - don't give in to the madness. Fight it, fight on, don't let them lull you into this false sense of security and joy. Don't ruin another gorgeous fall season for yourself.

But if you must watch, take off the rosy lenses; and if you must cheer, do so only with the knowledge that this is ephemeral, and the farther your elation carries, is that much farther until you hit the earth come September or so.

I only say this out of compassion, and my own hard road back from the Cubbie Cult.

In 1984 I lived one block - one block - from Wrigley Field. Oh, those were heady summer days; my poster of a wee bear cub on a tree trunk proclaimed my support from the front window of my forth story walk-up. My job at the local tavern was pure euphoria; the television was all Cubbies all the time, and the crowd, caught up in the fun and frenzy that was "This Year is THE Year!" was jovial and quite free with their cash (which they readily handed over as tips, telling me to buy myself something nice. I bought a replica Cubbie jersey, and wore it proudly night after night.) Oh. It was marvelous. Until. It wasn't anymore.

Suddenly the dancing in the streets ended with a whimper. People went back to grumbling, and Wrigley Field shut it's gates once more for the season, it's behemoth structure only serving as a grim reminder throughout that long, cold winter, of hopes dashed, dreams denied, and wondering what on earth possessed me to purchase a $60 replica jersey that did nothing for my figure.

But, do what you will. Consider this a cautionary tale only. I'm full of cautionary tales. I'm beginning to think that my whole purpose in life is to serve as a cautionary tale. I should have a t-shirt: "Cautionary Tale. Ask Me How."


Submitted by Marti on May 15, 2008 - 10:27pm.

Ya Gotta Believe!!!!!!!

Die-hard Northsiders Never, Ever Give up...even after 100 years!!!! Get that jersey out of storage NOW! :)

Submitted by Mary on May 15, 2008 - 12:25am.

(snip)

"However, when the city has a mayor who sends bulldozers out in the middle of the night to destroy a historic airfield, clearly local politics is rotten to the core."

I think that's a moment that most of us in Illinois will never forget....nor forgive.

Submitted by Tega on May 15, 2008 - 2:32am.

I believe it pissed the hell out of Kerry that even when he was the Democratic presidential nominee (and was pushed for by the Democratic party elites) in 2004, the Democratic people within the United States still looked at Bill Clinton as The Leader of the Democrats.

A way to screw Bill was to endorse Obama. It was also a way to try to lessen Democratic voters' support for Bill - be part of the campaign that will overturn the support of the Black community for Bill Clinton (and that would happen because Obama and team using the "Racecard" on Hillary and Bill).

Kerry wasn't strong enough to overpower Bill Clinton among Democratic voters. So he sided with Obama - someone who would use the Racecard to take away the Clintons' strongest supporters.

Obama, Kerry, Kennedy, Edwards, Jesse Jackson Jr all make me sick.

madspawn's picture
Submitted by madspawn on May 14, 2008 - 6:48pm.

I totally agree with everything you said, Jen. Especially the part about Clark doing what he minimally has to.

Wes Clark Democrats...let the Clinton campaign know who sent you


Submitted by Tega on May 15, 2008 - 2:02am.

Obama has polarized the Democratic Party and put a wedge in Race also.

Submitted by cubbiebear on May 15, 2008 - 2:07am.

as we have something they want.

early-bird's picture
Submitted by early-bird on May 14, 2008 - 6:13pm.

 http://online.wsj.com/article/SB121072447597990171.html

 
 

McCain Consultant Is Tied
To Work for Ukraine Party
Political Group
Had Opposed
Pro-Western Bloc
By MARY JACOBY and GLENN R. SIMPSON
May 14, 2008; Page A7

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080514/ap_on_el_pr/cindy_mccain_sudan

McCain's wife sells Sudan-related investments By JIM KUHNHENN, Associated Press Writer
5 minutes ago

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Get over it. It's so old by now. - Justice Antonin Scalia


Submitted by CentralMass on May 14, 2008 - 6:25pm.

The only thing McCain has to have going for him is not being Obama.

Submitted by briarhopper on May 14, 2008 - 6:46pm.

How many rats are going to jump onto this sinking ship? I heard that Edwards said Elizabeth is going to endorse a different candidate--that she doesn't like BO's health care plan, although she's rumored not to particularly like Hillary. Gee, women are so wise. We need one as President.

Submitted by m4clark on May 14, 2008 - 6:25pm.

As mad4clark mentioned a few days ago, Obama's our (Democratic Party's) "own little GWB". Apparently, his misstatements are continuing:

As mentioned on taylormarsh.com, Obama in Missouri: Obama posited -- incorrectly -- that Arabic translators deployed in Iraq are needed in Afghanistan -- forgetting, momentarily, that Afghans don't speak Arabic.

jen's picture
Submitted by jen on May 14, 2008 - 6:32pm.

Cut the guy a break! He's tired! He's not used to working this hard or long. It's haaaaard work running for president!

Weave Bawack Awone!!!!

Once in a while you get shown the light, In the strangest of places if you look at it right.


Submitted by VaDem on May 14, 2008 - 9:42pm.

The contrast of Hillary giving her WVA speech after winning and O!'s speech in Limbaugh's hometown was remarkable. The people behind him were bored, glum, distracted, chomping gum, looking all around, not cracking a single smile or look of enthusiasm. Of course, we know what Hillary looked like and how engaged her supporters were. If you get a chance to see his speech even for 1 minute, it will be striking.

Besides, his forehead was all crinkled up like he was a) sleepy/tired b) grumpy or c) concerned and didn't want to be there.

Submitted by James Mitchem on May 15, 2008 - 12:03am.

That is true, but many members of Al Qeada do in fact speak Arabic, including a certain 6 foot 4 inch nutjob we have been trying to catch for going on 7 years now most certainly does speak Arabic...

Submitted by cubbiebear on May 15, 2008 - 12:12am.

We've been trying to catch? Didn't you get the memo? Bush doesn't worry about him, he's old news.

mad4clark's picture
Submitted by mad4clark on May 14, 2008 - 6:44pm.

...getting scaredypoo of the big bad girl.

waaaaahhhhh

I hope this thing backfires like hell.

Women unite!!

"A nation that is afraid to let its people judge the truth and falsehood of ideas in an open market is a nation that is afraid of its people." JFK


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