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McCain on Social Security. McCain on kid's health care.

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I am asking you to come together and make sure Barack Obama is our next president. This is a critical mission. - Wes Clark

Wouldn't you like to see them have a Gerald Ford moment and fall face first into that cake?

We learn. We change. That's progress. If we don't do that, well, we're GWB.

I can't watch it out here in the dialup boonies, but I'm glad it's here for others to see.

After 8 years it will be sooooo nice to have a president that really is compassionate.

that you would somehow find a way to bring a put down on Obama and a "poor, poor Hillary, she's been so mistreated," spin.

Time to move on Tega.

The Republicans are the "enemy" not Barack Obama. If you don't let go and get around to recognizing that eventually I can't think of anything more to say than, I pity you.

That the racecard was used against Hillary to win an election.

Jesse Jackson Jr's accusation that Hillary didn't care about the Katrina victims was disgusting.

Sure, BO helping out in Illinois is a good thing. The Mid-West needs a lot of help asap. His supporters will praise that action, but many of his supporters, now believe that Hillary turned her back on those in need after Hurricane Katrina. I bet that when a good number of BO supporters see that photo, in their head they'll compare it to not only bush jr, but to Hillary (because of Jesse Jackson Jr's comment).

Suppose for a second that everyone agreed that the racecard was used against Hillary. How does that change where we are now?

I'm not real thrilled with the way things turned out. In my fantasies, Obama steps down and Wes is nominated. Oh, and as long as I'm fantasizing, he's wearing a speedo, the whole convention occurs poolside, and I'm watching from underneath a deck umbrella drinking a frozen strawberry daquari.

Realistically, given the way things are now, I'd like to see Obama beat McCain with a team that takes national security seriously, pushes fiscal responsibility, and somehow manages to get the whole country to stop being so mean. (OK, maybe that third one is more unrealistic than the poolside convention...)

Tega, what is it that you want to happen? Or maybe you haven't decided yet. That's ok. If you want to talk through possibilities, we're here.

We learn. We change. That's progress. If we don't do that, well, we're GWB.

But rolling over for what happened means it will happen again and again.

"Time to move on" (as told to Tega above) is exactly what the Repubs said after the 2000 election was stolen from Gore. And eight years later, we haven't moved an inch forward at the federal level on election reform.

I don't know the answer. But I know I've had enough.

Separate the problems and tackle them individually. The process is very broken, it's true. But I think that it's possible to separate that out from McCain vs. Obama.

They're two separate issues (the current dem vs. repub election and fixing the nominating process). Some people will want to focus on one, some on the other, and some people will want to do both. And I think we should all probably be supportive of each others' choices.

I think it will help us preserve our sanity if we don't confuse the two. If fixing the process is what you feel is most important, I think you might need to "move on" past Obama. Like you said, this started long before him. He's merely the latest beneficiary of the mess. I think from a practical standpoint, there are a lot of people who really like Obama who would be on your side if you wanted to fix the nomination process. Why piss them off? I don't think it's necessary to say anything bad about Obama to demonstrate how f'd up this all is. I honestly think that just leaving Obama's name out of the conversation will be a more effective game plan.

Personally, I'm so frustrated with the whole thing that I'd rather just play with cats (http://www.forgottencats.org). But I can't blame that on Obama.

We learn. We change. That's progress. If we don't do that, well, we're GWB.

There were people on BOTH sides that acted in ways that didn't benefit their choice of nominee. Which is why I have major problems with the "poor Sen. Clinton, she was SO mistreated" meme.

And I feel very sorry for Tega. Not only because she can't see the harm she's doing to herself, but she can't see the harm she's doing to Sen. Clinton.

I wish Tega luck though.

a thing I had no real need to say/deleted

filed under extraneous BS

"The citizen who sees his society's democratic clothes being worn out and does not cry out is not a patriot but a traitor."  -- Mark Twain

It's good that Obama is made a stop in Illinois to help people there if he can. He is their senator.

At least we know for sure that you're upside down. :D

General Discussion time?

I may be upside down but you're all over the place, westcott.

_{You'd be taking them to the Better Business Bureau if you bought a washing machine the way we went into the war in Iraq. Wes Clark, CNN Aug 17 2003}

And don't be a stranger here anymore.

Stan Davis
Lakewood, CO
Wes Clark -- Make America All It Can Be!

Guess I always figured I'd come back when a decision was reached about a candidate. And, fwiw, I would've returned no matter which candidate was selected.

I can see a few others have returned to the fold after being away, and that's a good thing for Gen Clark, even if it causes the tension that Tom's written about on another thread.

_{You'd be taking them to the Better Business Bureau if you bought a washing machine the way we went into the war in Iraq. Wes Clark, CNN Aug 17 2003}

Unfortunately, Phoebe, some others have gone away or are close to it. To the extent that the emphasis is now on Obama instead of Hillary, some folks can't "go there." I'm devoutly hoping that they can feel that they can come back at some point. I grieve when a friend goes away, especially if they're unhappy.

Stan Davis
Lakewood, CO
Wes Clark -- Make America All It Can Be!

I think all true Clarkies return eventually when they feel ready to "serve" again.

I felt pretty excluded before when the emphasis was on Hillary. And I was never strongly anti-Hillary, just liked Obama better and felt he had a better chance of winning the GE.

But, like I said, time out can be therapeutic.

I do understand how some are feeling pretty disillusioned right now. That's why I really didn't want to bound back in here blogging for Obama. Just felt like hanging around a bit again, which I've done in a lurking sense since getting Wes's email last week.

Figure if some of the former bloggers come back, it'll balance out the absence (short term, I hope) of some of the ones who feel they can't get behind Wes in the direction he's taking now.

_{You'd be taking them to the Better Business Bureau if you bought a washing machine the way we went into the war in Iraq. Wes Clark, CNN Aug 17 2003}

Good to see you!

Hope all is well "down under".

I also felt pretty excluded before. To the point I felt it was better to wait until the General Election to come back.

And I wasn't anti-Clinton either. I just didn't think she was the best choice for president and had too many negatives to win the election in the GE. Which doesn't change the fact I would have voted for her in the GE had she won the nomination.

I'm hoping the people who are feeling upset or angry at Sen. Obama's win can get beyond their feelings and follow Sen. Clinton and Gen. Clark's lead in getting behind Sen. Obama. Because the enemy is not Clinton Clarkies or Obama Clarkies.

The target is to defeat McCain, and increase Democratic margins in the House and Senate. THAT'S the fight, not cold spagetti rehashes of who did what to whom in the primaries. Because there were people on BOTH sides that didn't do their side any favours.

...still down under

another reason to come back. when I wasn't here I wasn't getting any Bob Dole jokes.

Of course, Bob Dole isn't getting any either...boom-tish!

_{You'd be taking them to the Better Business Bureau if you bought a washing machine the way we went into the war in Iraq. Wes Clark, CNN Aug 17 2003}

:)