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General Wesley Clark on WIOD with John "Footy" Kross in Miami FL
November 9, 2007
transcript by Reg NYC
Footy: On the line with us now, General Wesley Clark. General, good morning.
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK:Good morning.
Footy: Now, uh, just in the way of introductions, my name is Footy. I've been doing radio here in Miami for a very long time. I won't bore you with how I got the name. But I believe we have something in common. ah, my brother is a friend of yours -- General Walter Cross.
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: He is a friend of mine, and he's a great guy.
Footy:Yeah, and I spoke to him this morning and I told him I was going to be speaking to you and he said to be sure I gave you and yours his regards and he hopes to see you soon.
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: Well, great, and I appreciate it. No, he was, he's a fine man. He was a great leader in the military. He's just a really good guy.
Footy: And that's what your book is about, A Time To Lead: For Dut-, Duty, Honor and Country. I-
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: I wanted to talk about some of the leadership lessons I learned, but also wanted to talk about America. Because I think leadership- there are things you can do as an individual, but there's things a country can do. It's all about leadership in life. It's about influencing other people the right way. You know?
Footy: Yeah, you- I, I, think a lot of people end up in positions of authority or leadership and really don't understand the responsibilities of it. I see it every day in the, you know, in the regular world, in the business world, in the functional world. And I say to myself, you know, there's more to it than just having a plaque on the door or a, you know, a star on your name.
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: Exactly. I think it starts by really understanding the people that you're leading and respecting those people and then earning their respect. I think leadership is performance oriented. In other words, it doesn't matter what you look like necessarily, whether you're big or little, man or a woman, whatever. Those are external characteristics, but what really matters is: Can you take the talents and the characteristics that you've been given as a person and put them together in a way that you can influence people and achieve the results you're seeking?
Footy: Have you ever been in a position where you, where you were in - you, I mean, you've been at the Joint Chiefs, I mean, valedictorian of your class at West Point. I mean, you've done, you've done everything - has there ever been a minute, a moment where you doubted yourself, where it was really like you didn't, you just felt unsure?
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: Oh certainly! I mean, per- you have, you have to sort of look over the edge of the cliff in life. You have to think about some of the worst outcomes. You have to sort of plan on how you're going to avoid those outcomes. you have to live with that uncertainty and work to m- to, to narrow down the range of the uncertainties. Absolutely. That, that's all part of survival in a leadership position.
Footy: But-
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: You can't, you have to be honest with yourself, and if you're honest with yourself you're going to find (laughs) a lot of uncertainties-
Footy: (laughs)
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: -and a lot of problems.
Footy: Yeah, were, were you ever scared, scared. I mean, you've been in combat and you've- I m- I mean, it's a stupid question, because everybody's been scared. But maybe I guess the question is: Was there ever a time where you didn't think you were going to make it?
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: Well, I got shot too fast-
Footy: Yeah.
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: -to be scared.
Footy: Ha, ha.
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: What happens, I mean, fear is present in war, especially when you're in circumstances where you can't determine the outcome, where shells are coming in on you, rockets are landing around you, and you're just passive and, and there. I was in a position where I got shot right away and then I was active. And so, fear doesn't have the same grip on you in circumstances like that.
Footy: Yeah, because you already had it. So, you know what it is, and-
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: Fear is a very human emotion. Everybody's going to feel it at times in their life.
Footy: Yeah. The war in Iraq, you have been, your positions is really pretty, I mean very well known. You've been very clear. I don't want to speak for you, but you're basically saying we should get out of there and get out of there as quickly as we can?
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: Exactly. I, I think that it was a war we didn't have to fight. We went in. Everybody knew we could whip Saddam's army. That was never a big issue, and I thought we wouldn't have any problem taking Baghdad either. BUT we didn't plan for what would happen next. There was never a real understanding of the dynamics of Iraq. It's taken us a long time to get a grip on it. We've spent a lot of money, and you know, hopefully we will succeed in Iraq. I certainly don't want to see us fail, but the success is not going to be the bold, visionary, Western-oriented, Democratic government-
Footy: Mm, yeah.
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: -that President George Bush talks about. It's likely to be something far, far less, l-l-less helpful to the United States.
Footy: May-
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: Probably going to be a strongman government. Might have some ruling committee. Probably going to be extremist in sympathy. Probably going to be closely allied with Iran. Probably not going to be very helpful or, or grateful to the United States. That's just reality.
Footy: I-I agree with you. You know, and I obviously don't have anywhere near the information, the training or understanding of it, but and, and I think the mistake that the American people make and maybe even the President, or even the President is that we have this idea of democracy and it's the greatest thing and it's how we should live and how everybody should live and it's the greatest thing. They don't have that idea. They're, they, it's, we're trying to I guess sort of foist democracy on a culture that doesn't want it and doesn't see it as the greatest thing.
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: Well, they don't understand it.
Footy: Yeah.
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: And the United States government, as I write in the book, is about limiting the power of the Executive Branch. We revolted against a king who was a CEO. We don't like CEO-led government in America. We want checks and balances. We want nobody to have so much power over us that any single person can interfere with our freedom. We don't mind if there are rules that we follow, but we want them made through a process that takes into account majority and minority opinions. And it's worked for America, but it's just one system. It may not be the right system for some countries.
Footy: Wesley, Wesley, who are you going to vote for for President.
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK:: Oh, Hillary Clinton. I've already endorsed her.
Footy: Oh, you have?
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: Oh, absolutely. I hope she'll make the nomination.
Footy: You think it's, do you think a woman or a person of color, like Obama is, do you think the country is truly ready for that? You think they'll take that step?
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: Well, I think it's, you know, it's going to be less about that than it is about the issues in the campaign, the safely of America. The Democratic Party is about fairness, but we're also pretty good about national security. The Republican Party is about strength. They proved to be pretty bad at national security, but sometimes it's hard for Americans who are not in the political world and not looking at the issue closely every day to, to, to understand that tough talk doesn't necessarily translate into effective action. That's the problem. The Republican Party talks tough, but they haven't performed well. Democrats are about fairness. We'll just have to see how the election goes.
Footy: We're talking to General Wesley Clark. A Time To Lead: Dut- Duty, Honor and Country is the book. Where's the book available, I guess everywhere?
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: Everywhere and it's at Amazon, of course, and it's in Borders, and it's in Barnes And Nobles, and it's in a lot of airports and a lot of the private book stores.
Footy: General Clark, I appreciate your time. I know you're very busy. I want to thank you for joining us here on the Footy Show. I'll tell my brother you said hello. And good luck and thank you for your service.
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: Thanks a lot Footy.
Footy: Alright, see you later.
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: Great to be with you.
Footy: B-Bye.
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: Bye now.
Footy: Wow, General Wesley Clark, as you see- well, I've been around a lot of those guys because of brother and I always get a little like, like I'm talking to the teacher. You know? (laughs) They're just so smart, and I mean, whether you agree or disagree or what side of the issues you're on, these guys are sharp.
