General Wesley Clark on Your World with Neil Cavuto
January 25, 2006
Transcript by RegNYC
Neil Cavuto: Lawmakers from both sides of the aisle pushing for harsh UN sanctions, and they're not even ruling out military force to stop that country from getting a nuclear bomb. But by focusing on Iran so much, are we ignoring what could be and even greater and bigger danger, Syria?
Welcome everybody, I'm Neil Cavuto and this is Your World. One of America's most wanted terrorists reportedly spotted in Syria just last week. Imad Mugniyah is wanted for the 1985 hijacking of TWA flight 847 - remember that one- in which a Navy diver was beaten, tortured, shot in the head, his body dumped on a tarmac at a Beirut airport.
Is Syria harboring the terrorist behind that and many other acts, and what should the US do about it? Let's ask former Presidential candidate, former NATO Supreme Commander General Wesley Clark. He's also a Fox News contributor. General, good to have you.
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: Thank you, Neil.
Neil Cavuto: Syria's the one country I think we forget about. Is it a threat?
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: Well, we shouldn't. Well, Syria is one of those countries that this is an historic opportunity for the United States with Syria. It's not too late. You know Syria's under a lot of pressure. They're under pressure from the UN investigation of, of the Lebanese former Prime Hariri's assassination. They're under pressure economically. They're under pressure because they're caught in a squeeze play ideologically. This is the time that the United States should be talking with Syria.
Neil Cavuto: When you say "talking" with Syria, what do mean?
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: I mean sending the right people in there-
Neil Cavuto: Who?
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: -undercover, high level people, maybe Steve Hadley, maybe one of Steve's deputies, to actually lay out the possibility of-
Neil Cavuto: But not at the highest level.
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: Not- The President can't go there, but people in there - it can be done.
Neil Cavuto: But how can you do that now, General, when you have the leaders of Iran and Syria paling around together.
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: Believe me. It can be done.
Neil Cavuto: Yeah.
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: There's- In this part of the world, people talk and fight together with each other simultaneously at all levels. And if we're in this part of the world, we got to not only have military force, we got to have our full widths: our intelligence, our leadership, our ability to mobilize international law and diplomacy. We should tell Bashar Assad and Syria that this is his moment to do an historic transformation of Syria. He needs to get the terrorists out by working with us. He needs to set the Syrian economy moving in the right direction. He needs to lay the foundations for Democracy.
Neil Cavuto; He's ignored even the verbal overtures though. So I mean, he has a history of, of certainly sticking it to the US.
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: Well, the administration-
Neil Cavuto: -and he might even be behind some prominent assassinations in Lebanon. So, I'm wondering if he's the guy to do that with, or he's the only guy we can deal with from there.
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: Well, he's the guy who's there right now. He's in power. He's got some big weaknesses, and he needs us if we work with him the right way, and we could use him as a transitional figure. But you know, diplomacy is- it's not about- this is not about somebody that you, you are necessarily admire you ideals or their conduct. This is about serving and protecting the interests of the United States of America and our friends and allies in the region and advancing the cause of Democracy. And the truth is that we've got alternatives. We don't necessarily have to invade and occupy Syria, but if we don't talk, and the worst comes to it, we may well find ourselves doing that.
Neil Cavuto: Do you suspect that more of the insurgent activity, more of maybe the hidden weapons activity, if you want to call it that, is at it's roots in Syria more than it is in Iran?
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: Well, I think it's- there are different motivations. First of all, Syria and Iran are a little bit aligned and Syria uses Iran's strength as a buffer against Israel to do what it wants. But when the United States went into the region, the talk was all over the Middle East, just like it was in Washington and the Weekly Standard, that it was Iraq first and then Syria, Lebanon and then Iran. And so these nations, in their own defense, made sure that they would stymie what the United States wanted to do in Iraq. So yes, an insurgent base grew up in Syria. I know we're trying to take action against that base in one way and another, reinforcing the border. We've had some low-level dialogs. You know, the Syrians initially said they'd cooperate with us on intelligence. But what
we've got to do is we've got to get to Bashar Assad, because the alternative to doing that is to muddle through, wait for Syria to collapse, and we'll have another failed state on our hands - a failed state that, one way or another, is going to be a danger, a bigger danger to the Middle East and it will cause us to take action - actions with our over-stretched military that we really don't need to take. What we need to do is let them work it.
Neil Cavuto: When you say it's over-stretched, too over-stretched to do something about Iran right now?
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: Depends on what you're going to do about Iran. Now, you can certainly run bombing strikes and Special Forces activities and you can go after those nuclear sites. You could-
Neil Cavuto: You have to know where those nuclear sites are.
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: I think that's less of a problem. I think the, the greater problem is figuring out what's the end state. Let's say you, you run eight to fourteen days of bombing against Iran. You take out thirty sites, maybe fifteen of them were the nuclear sites. You've taken out some command and control, his missiles, his air bases, some of the stuff that would threaten us along the literal of the Persian Gulf. Okay, and then what? What happens? Does he then say, 'Oh, I give up. I surrender. I'll be your friend."? No, he's not going to say that.
Neil Cavuto: But who cares, if he's less of a threat?
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: Because what he's going to do is he's going to be a magnet-
Neil Cavuto: I see.
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: - pulling in all kinds of anti-American resistance. How do we know A.-
Neil Cavuto: So, it'll actually galvanize Arab-
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: How do we know A.Q. Kahn's not going to replenish that nuclear stock right away.
Neil Cavuto: Yeah.
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: So, it's a danger. We've got to think through the thing, not just from the initial strikes, not 'Can we hit the target? Can we penetrate Iranian airspace?' Of course we can do that. It's 'What's the end state- strategically, geopolitically? How do we handle the conflict in this part of the world?'
Neil Cavuto: Let me ask you, before you came here I was telling you I read this piece in the New York Observer today about Al Gore and what he's up to. many people say, 'You know, we miss Al. We like Al, and he'd maybe be a credible candidate in 2008." What do you make of that?
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: Well, I think he is a credible candidate. I mean, he's experienced. He's broadly versed. He's spent six years recovering from effects (laughs) of being in elected office for all his life.
Neil Cavuto: Do you think he's running?
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: I suspect he'd like to be President of the United States, and so-
Neil Cavuto: Could he get the nomination?
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: I don't know. I mean, I think that in both parties everything is really up for grabs right now. I think, despite the fact of what the polls say, I think there's- the American people are listening. You know-
Neil Cavuto: But you know, those same polls General, with all due respect and I know we've talked about his in the past, blame your party for not having a consistent voice on terror. How would you respond to it?
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: I think the Democrats have been very consistent on the problem of terrorism. I think that what they recognize is that you've got to have a policy in the world that not only uses military force, but first uses diplomacy, then uses international law enforcement, but only as a last resort-
Neil Cavuto: But sir, I don't see that, I don't see that consistency. I see, you know, Joe Lieberman saying one thing. You're saying another, John Kerry, I don't know what he's saying. So, I think the rap against Democrats, fairly or not, when they're asked, Americans are asked on this issue of security who best to protect us, your part doesn't come out well, because that is the perception.
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: I think it's deeper than that.
Neil Cavuto: You agree, right. It's the eye of the beholder. Would you ever want to run for President because your party seems to be too far to the left.
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: I'm in the business community right now. I haven't said anything about my political future one way or the other.
Neil Cavuto: You did okay.
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: I-
Neil Cavuto: First time out. No political experience.
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: I am, I am proud of it.
Neil Cavuto: Would you- Would you like to be President?
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: I'm proud of being a Democrat.
Neil Cavuto: Would you like to be President?
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: But here's the thing Neil on the, on the-
Neil Cavuto: You're not going to answer me, are you?
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: Well, I want to talk about the issues you're raising, because I think, you know, I know political speculation's a lot of fun, but I think this country's got some very serious issues in front of it
Neil Cavuto: You've said, General, your party has some problems in getting a voice out on this issue.
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: It does. You know why? Because-
Neil Cavuto: So, if- if your party is to the left on these issues of security which you hold near and dear would you then say, 'You know what? You're not listening. You're not speaking to the American people. I will,' ?
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: Well, I've been speaking out all along on Fox, in speeches and across the country, in various fora. I'm giving a speech in Washington next Monday, and-
Neil Cavuto: Do you think Hillary Clinton is?
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: And Hillary Clinton is speaking out. A lot of Democrats are speaking out. But I'll tell you what the issue is really. The issue is that if you're not in the majority in one of the two Houses of Congress and you don't occupy the White House it's real hard to get a consistent message out. It's a mechanical thing. Now the Republicans did finally pull it together in 1994 with the Contract for America, but it was done around an election, and it came together.
Neil Cavuto: But you'll admit that your party is not exactly on the same page on this issue.
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: Well, I don't know. I, I would- Don't sell, don't sell America short. Look, we believe in a two-party system in this country, and you know and your party as - if you're a Republican, and you got to be proud of your party and what it's done- but you also know that a two-party system is essential, because power corrupts.
Neil Cavuto: If Al Gore were to come to you and say, 'General, I need your advice'-
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: I'm talking to everybody.
Neil Cavuto: Okay.
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: Listen, if anybody comes to me and says they want my advice, I talk to them.
Neil Cavuto: Alright General, always good seeing you. General Wesley Clark.
