General Wesley Clark on Fox & Friends
April 16, 2006
Transcription by Melange

Kiran Chetry: Meantime, former generals are lining up and taking sides over the criticism of Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld. We hear both sides of the fight today from a pair of our most highly decorated warriors. Joining me this morning in Little Rock, Arkansas, former NATO Supreme Allied Commander General Wesley Clark and also in DC retired Air Force Lieutenant General Tom McInerney. Both are Fox News analysts and Generals, I welcome both of you to the show this morning.

GENERAL WESLEY CLARK &

LT. GENERAL TOM MCINERNEY: Thank you.

Kiran Chetry: Let me start with you General Clark because you're one of…a few of these generals who have come out publicly criticizing Donald Rumsfeld. There have been six who think he should step down. What is the goal of that public criticism?

GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: Well it's to tell the truth to the American people. Basically this administration's pursuit of policy that's a mistake in policy in the war on terror; anything from not finishing the fight against Osama bin Laden to an unnecessary war in Iraq and a poor prosecution of the war. So Secretary Rumsfeld's the accountable official. The policy hasn't worked the way it should have; Secretary Rumsfeld should be replaced. It's really a matter of accountability in government.

Kiran Chetry: What would be a solution, I guess? If he should step down now, what would improve in Iraq, in your opinion?

GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: Well I think the real problem is that you've got another set of foreign policy challenges facing us right now. Not only is the war on terrorism not over but now we have to deal with the issue of possible military actions against Iran so we need the American people to come together, we need a leader who can bring our allies together. I was one of those who ran for president, I believed the accountability should go right to the top. The American people didn't see it that way, they re-elected George Bush but we're still in trouble on national security.

Kiran Chetry: Uh, General McInerney, I'm interested to get your point of view on the criticism. What do you think of your fellow generals coming out publicly, which is something that is a little bit rare within the military, and criticizing and calling for Rumsfeld to step down?

LT. GENERAL TOM MCINERNEY: Yes it is, Kiran. First, let me say I don't agree with it is their right. The difference I would say is General Clark moved into the political arena so I can criticize his views which I don't agree before except Iran that he stated. The others have not moved into the political arena officially yet but they're now part of it. I don't believe that's the role of retired generals and I don't think it helps our will as a nation. Now there's no way we can lose the war in Iraq with the US military. It can only be lost back here and when you have retired generals being politically manipulated and, of course in General Clark's position, when the democratic party elected to oppose the war after voting for it and General Clark and I were both testifying in front of the House Armed Services Committee, he did not say that before the war. I think…<crosstalk>

Kiran Chetry: Let me just ask…

LT. GENERAL TOM MCINERNEY: It's important that once you commit forces then you should not break the will of the United States. That's very important.

Kiran Chetry: And I…General McInerney I know a lot of people feel that way but just playing devil's advocate, if - leave General Clark out of it for a second - if for some don't…who are not in the political arena, is there an…I guess…obligation if you do feel…if you're on the ground and you feel things are not going right to say so or is this not the appropriate place?

LT. GENERAL TOM MCINERNEY: But that's not what they're saying. They don't like his leadership style. First of all, they're two-star generals, they don't deal and didn't deal directly with the Secretary of Defense. If they have a problem, it ought to be the three- and four-stars. The four-stars coming out, General Myers, General Franks, General Rifle DeLong, these people are saying that they support this Secretary. Now, underlying this Kiran, here's the problem: they're all Army generals except the two marines and I can separate them but the Army had a problem with transformation. It did not want to go to the joint forces. They had two major weapons systems cancelled, they had to go get their next chief of staff outside the Army, someone who had retired and there's a great deal of anger at Secretary Rumsfeld for that but they shouldn't let that get involved with the politics. Transformation is going on we've brilliantly won two campaigns in Afghanistan and Iraq, took down the most powerful nation in that region in 21 days.

Kiran Chetry: Alright, well let me just ask General Clark about that. Some have said 'it's the turf battle, it's the resistance to change that Rumsfeld wanted to bring into the armed forces,' do you agree?

GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: No, I don't think it has anything to do with that. I think it really has to do with the fact that the United States armed forces have been very hard stretched in a war that many of the supporters predicted would be a “cakewalk”. The foreign policy predictions, the actions haven't been right a lot of people had a reserve and concerns about these actions before they were taken. People in the Pentagon knew long…right after 9/11 I was told by officers in the Pentagon that this administration was bound and determined to push us into a war with Saddam Hussein and contrary to what Tom said, at least as I think I understood him say it, I have been speaking out against this since early 2002 and warning that this was an unnecessary war. I'm well on record for that. <crosstalk>

Kiran Chetry: Alright,

GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: …and it hasn't worked out well. These generals are expressing the frustration of that.

Kiran Chetry: Let me just hear comments on this: the Defense Department issued a memo and one of the things that they were countering are some of the claims that Rumsfeld ran roughshod over the generals and didn't ask. They say that he met 139 different times with the Joint Chiefs of Staff since the start of the war and had 208 meetings in that time with senior field commanders. That seems like a lot of meetings to gauge success and strategy.

GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: Well it's not about how many meetings you have, really it's about the results. What I'm trying to say is, and I think what these generals are saying is, there are people who understood that you needed more troops, that this wasn't going to be a cakewalk, that you needed to do certain things. The Secretary of Defense chose not to listen to that advice, he chose to run the war his way. It hasn't worked, he's accountable. He should be held accountable. It's up to the President to make the decision and get somebody in there who can lead the Defense Department. He's the number two person in the chain of command <crosstalk>

Kiran Chetry: Okay I've got to let General McInerney last word in, just a couple of seconds here and we've got to go.

LT. GENERAL TOM MCINERNEY: Well look, we are winning over there. Is it a tough fight? You bet it's a tough fight, but the fact is IED's and car bombs which you just announced in the time of when they blow them up over there to get on to US media. The fact is is they're not going to defeat the US forces.

Kiran Chetry: Alright, we're out of time. Thanks to both of you.

LT. GENERAL TOM MCINERNEY: Thank you Kiran.

GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: Thanks Kiran.